The Dean of Doom series (companion thread)

4 hours ago, omalefico32x said:

damn dude that doesnt sound too good

did you get into an accident and had to remove your eye?

I don't want to hijack rd's thread so I'll try to keep it short: I had a condition called Uveitis in my left eye, bought on by previous trauma (a fight with a thumb gouger). This trauma later developed into Uveitis which floored me as I always had above average vision.

However, before I told the specialist that story he was adamant that it was due to some exotic virus, one they knew very little about. My immune system won the battle, but not before it had done irreversible damage to the iris. To be frank, in the end I don't think even he knew what had caused it. As soon as I answered his question about previous trauma he quickly switched to that as being the cause.

It was a long running condition spanning 7 years and it became highly photo-sensitive to light. It was like a white-hot knife shoved into my eye socket and then twisted every time I went outside. UV light was the worst, but even false light (lightbulbs etc) were aggravating it near the end. 

I have broken bones, been burned and have plenty of scares from serious cuts, but in all my time on this earth I have never experienced such paralyzing acute pain. Thanks to the optic nerve connecting straight to the mainframe computer (my brain).

There was no distraction from this agony. I couldn't go outside, watch a Tv or play my Pc. When it was bad all I could do was to curl up on my bed and clench my teeth. Some days I was fine, just blurry vision in my left eye, other days the pain would drag on for long torturous hours.

Anyway, that is believe it or not the abridged version. It spans several years so you can imagine. But I had it removed in the end. A story in itself because the specialist misunderstood my quick answer of "remove it" before the question even left his lips about keeping it or surgically removing it. Somehow he thought I was trying to be brave/manly or something. Que him wasting time trying to convince me to think about it for a few days.

It should have been obvious that I had already considered this outcome and done some deep thinking on it. He was a little short-sighted (excuse the pun) and completely mistook my instant answer as "acting brave and heroic". Hilarious I know, but he was a kind man so I can't be too harsh.

Regardless, apologies for the rambling but I get carried away sometimes. This is rd's thread and I'm kind of hijacking it with this, I can also smell the stench of my own attention seeking. Hopefully it didn't come across that way, it wasn't intended. Goodluck!

6 hours ago, Doomkid said:

Not to derail the thread, but that is fucking gnarly and sounds like hell.. :( Hope you recover well and that getting used to it proves easier than it sounds..

Thanks Doomkid. I'm actually fine, happy even. Although that may be down to the fact I'm doped up.

I'm actually relieved to be honest. I have no regrets and I'm adamant it was the right decision. My natural state is upbeat and happy-go-lucky, not a snarling wounded animal (which is what I was on a bad day). I feel much more like myself and it may sound odd but...I learned a lot from it. I did a lot of reflecting during that time. While I may have lost my eye, I gained something else which is priceless: wisdom. 

Yeah, I know that may sound cheesy but it is what it is. I'm still debating with myself if it was an even trade though heh. Time will tell I suppose.

I checked out the TNT Revilution video (I always look for something with me in first, to gauge their opinion against mine) and it's an entertaining watch. I think I'll check more of these out, as I'm familiar with quite a lot of what he's played so far. It's informative, well-narrated and written with a bit of passion for the subject matter, which shows through.

5 hours ago, Final Verdict said:

 

I don't want to hijack rd's thread so I'll try to keep it short: I had a condition called Uveitis in my left eye, bought on by previous trauma (a fight with a thumb gouger). This trauma later developed into Uveitis which floored me as I always had above average vision.

 

However, before I told the specialist that story he was adamant that it was due to some exotic virus, one they knew very little about. My immune system won the battle, but not before it had done irreversible damage to the iris. To be frank, in the end I don't think even he knew what had caused it. As soon as I answered his question about previous trauma he quickly switched to that as being the cause.

 

It was a long running condition spanning 7 years and it became highly photo-sensitive to light. It was like a white-hot knife shoved into my eye socket and then twisted every time I went outside. UV light was the worst, but even false light (lightbulbs etc) were aggravating it near the end. 

 

I have broken bones, been burned and have plenty of scares from serious cuts, but in all my time on this earth I have never experienced such paralyzing acute pain. Thanks to the optic nerve connecting straight to the mainframe computer (my brain).

 

There was no distraction from this agony. I couldn't go outside, watch a Tv or play my Pc. When it was bad all I could do was to curl up on my bed and clench my teeth. Some days I was fine, just blurry vision in my left eye, other days the pain would drag on for long torturous hours.

 

Anyway, that is believe it or not the abridged version. It spans several years so you can imagine. But I had it removed in the end. A story in itself because the specialist misunderstood my quick answer of "remove it" before the question even left his lips about keeping it or surgically removing it. Somehow he thought I was trying to be brave/manly or something. Que him wasting time trying to convince me to think about it for a few days.

 

It should have been obvious that I had already considered this outcome and done some deep thinking on it. He was a little short-sighted (excuse the pun) and completely mistook my instant answer as "acting brave and heroic". Hilarious I know, but he was a kind man so I can't be too harsh.

 

Regardless, apologies for the rambling but I get carried away sometimes. This is rd's thread and I'm kind of hijacking it with this, I can also smell the stench of my own attention seeking. Hopefully it didn't come across that way, it wasn't intended. Goodluck!

 

 

Thanks Doomkid. I'm actually fine, happy even. Although that may be down to the fact I'm doped up.

 

I'm actually relieved to be honest. I have no regrets and I'm adamant it was the right decision. My natural state is upbeat and happy-go-lucky, not a snarling wounded animal (which is what I was on a bad day). I feel much more like myself and it may sound odd but...I learned a lot from it. I did a lot of reflecting during that time. While I may have lost my eye, I gained something else which is priceless: wisdom. 

 

Yeah, I know that may sound cheesy but it is what it is. I'm still debating with myself if it was an even trade though heh. Time will tell I suppose.

 

damn dude it sucks you had to pass trough all that but im really happy that you are fine now

and now you can go back to playing doom with is always good

ok jokes aside im glad you are happy

7 hours ago, Bauul said:

I've also been enjoying his videos a lot.  This might sound kind of heretical, but there's a decent whack of older megawads that it's unlikely I'll ever find the time to play through myself, so from a "history of Doom content" point of view having a thorough summary of each megawad is a really nice way of learning about it in detail without needing to actually spend the time playing through it.

its so weird hearing from you because everytime i search something slightely related to doom even if it is on other sites it seens like you peter lawrence and doomkid are always present

11 hours ago, Final Verdict said:

While I may have lost my eye, I gained something else which is priceless: wisdom. 

Do you have two pet ravens and an eight-legged horse?

13 hours ago, omalefico32x said:

its so weird hearing from you because everytime i search something slightely related to doom even if it is on other sites it seens like you peter lawrence and doomkid are always present

Not to derail the thread, but... you do? Are you sure you're not getting me mixed up with someone else? I wouldn't have thought that I had that kind of online presence.

1 hour ago, Bauul said:

 

Not to derail the thread, but... you do? Are you sure you're not getting me mixed up with someone else? I wouldn't have thought that I had that kind of online presence.

i mean unless there is another guy named bauul with the same profile pic as yours

1 hour ago, Bauul said:

 

Not to derail the thread, but... you do? Are you sure you're not getting me mixed up with someone else? I wouldn't have thought that I had that kind of online presence.

heres an example and obscure video with 52 views and here you are in the comments

I may have binged basically every video yesterday for this series. They’re quite compelling! It also gave me a lot of insight into the “modern” megaWADs that I don’t enjoy, showing me the appeal for somebody who does like them, whilst reminding me of why I don’t like them. The enthusiasm and interest is great to watch and I’ll definitely follow on for future videos!

1 hour ago, Phobus said:

I may have binged basically every video yesterday for this series. They’re quite compelling! It also gave me a lot of insight into the “modern” megaWADs that I don’t enjoy, showing me the appeal for somebody who does like them, whilst reminding me of why I don’t like them. The enthusiasm and interest is great to watch and I’ll definitely follow on for future videos!

Same here, I spent most of yesterday going through his Dean of Doom series.

I'm not capable of much else for the next few weeks so this was a goldmine of content for me. I cannot believe I was unaware of Mt.Pain having his own youtube channel. The name rang a bell but my med induced mind couldn't connect the dots. That happened the next day when I noticed his thumbnail/avatar. I realised he was a DW member I had not only seen make a few posts, but I'm fairly certain I even talked to him a few times last year.

I wouldn't mind normally but his content is so clear and concise, so well formatted and thought out, that it almost feels like I have committed some cardinal sin in being unaware of his youtube channel. Definitely up there with the greats in Doomtubing, worth keeping an eye on. 

That's not to say I agree with every assessment he makes on a Wad/Map, but he's generally on point. 

I love MTPain's videos. They show you which wads are historically significant and get to the point really well, and the occasional small jokes are all funny. 

The only thing I disagree with is why did he give Lunar Mining Project a low grade for being dull, uninspired, and short, but then gave a higher grade to Unruly Evil which is all that but worse lol.

At this point, I've watched all of his videos at least once. I actually find myself disagreeing with a LOT of the grades he gives, but that's become part of the fun of watching. Dean of Doom is probably my favourite doom-related content on youtube.

Something I did when watching new videos of his for the first time on a wad I have played is try to guess what grades he’ll give certain levels. It can be quite enjoyable on top of a already enjoyable experience.

I must admit I'm hyped for any release of mine that MtPain might get round to reviewing - although thinking on it, I have concerns should he choose to review and rank anything of mine from around the Jenesis era. If he's going for 100% kills in every map, he's going to have a rough time. I simply did not bear this playstyle in mind at all.

On 3/30/2021 at 7:15 PM, Jimmy said:

I must admit I'm hyped for any release of mine that the MtPain might get round to reviewing - although thinking on it, I have concerns should he choose to review and rank anything of mine from around the Jenesis era. If he's going for 100% kills in every map, he's going to have a rough time. I simply did not bear this playstyle in mind at all.

unless you are gene bird i think you are fine

I hope @MtPain27 knows this thread exists :)

Anyway, I watched Dean of Doom for some time before I joined this forum. Found a lot of good WADs that way, including all of my top three: Ancient Aliens, Japanese Community Project, and Eviternity.

A new episode just dropped all!!!

It’s Sunlust!!! ;-P

I don’t want to spoil anything but the changes he has made to the rating system are pure gold XD

WOOT! New video, folks.

Great channel, just subscribed.

That was a truly fantastic video.  Absolutely best one he's done so far.  The detail, the insight, the pure commitment to artistic integrity.  Absolute Grade A stuff.  I'd put it among the best reviews of any wad I've ever seen.

3 hours ago, rd. said:

 

I had some thoughts on this one surface a few times. 

 

Interestingly, the idea that saving is shameful and "good players" rarely do it, that saves are an admission of weakness, doesn't come from these "good players." 

 

The source is varied and hard to pin down exactly, but I think it's a notion that is reinforced by visibility: top players share their final runs on YouTube, but not their practice and prep sessions or their leisure play (not that they should...that's just what happens). I went through "saving = weakness" phases in bygone years (those are probably concentrated in 2016-2018), so I kind of know where the impulse comes from, and unchecked assumption has a lot to do with that. It's also reinforced by the noxious machismo that lingers in any gaming community, especially the unmoderated places, by bullies and trolls who invent a distorted image of a "hardcore no-save player" and then use it, as a cudgel, to shame people who don't match up. "You used saves??? Well Decino didn't need them!?!" 

 

Over the years, I've been lucky to share a Discord server with or watch streams of many really good players, so I've gotten a more accurate picture than that.

 

Of the 15 players I think of as probably the most skilled 15 singleplayer Doomers (which I'm listing only to be concrete)...

 

0xf00ba12, 4shockblast, Ancalagon, Aquasa, Daerik, Depravity, DotW, j4rio, Koren, Looper, MrZzul, Nevanos, stx-Vile, TheViperKiller, Zeromaster

 

...just two of them disavow saves in casual play, meaning outside of demos and challenges. One of them is among the chillest people ever, and I know for a fact it isn't an ego thing. He loves the heightened stakes of deaths indicating resets, and I've seen him redo long stretches of maps after dying with zenlike calm. The other is similar, actually, minus the "zenlike calm" part. 

 

More common is someone like MrZzul (aka Killer5). He has done some really impressive saveless runs of slaughtermaps, some of which are total buttclenchers (those pits are inescapable). He also streams casual plays on Twitch from time to time. What happens then? Well, more often than not, he dutifully uses the save key between every fight.

 

In most games, the most efficient way to practice involves repeatedly playing harder, important sections, without having to reclaim the entire map to get back to that point in exchange for one shot. It's like a pianist drilling a tricky section of a piece with one hand over and over, to gain the requisite technique, or an athlete getting thousands of isolated reps of a fundamental skill instead of hoping to improve only in games. Top players use the tools at their disposal, with no sign of turning their nose up at saves.  

 

Then there is the matter of trying to cram lots of different activities into limited spare time. Speedrunners sometimes want to try out cool releases like everyone else. Juggling both the run grind and saveless casual play would eat up a lot of time. So, unsurprisingly, someone like stx-Vile, one of the original Compet-N legends who is still active and streams on Twitch, saves between fights in his leisurely play.

 

In that paragraph, if you replace "run grind" with "things in life other than Doom," you get the more common use case of saves for people who aren't speedrunners or challenge maxers. That parallel shows one way that people who enjoy the game in very different ways have a lot in common. 

 

Even the best players out there don't view saving as a shameful thing. So anyone who pushes others to feel that way is, at that point, either misinformed or full of it. 

Great post as always.

I similarly underwent a no saves phase (2018-2020), motivated by the desire to hone my skills which were clearly lacking at the time. Beating Speed of Doom was actually the catalyst to make me reconsider my preferred playstyle - I realized I had hit my skill ceiling and was unlikely to improve whether I kept playing saveless or not.

Nowadays I take advantage of DSDA-Doom's rewind feature, which gives me a safeguard in case I mess up badly. Interestingly I've noticed that since the switch I'm getting better, not in terms of raw skill but in terms of being able to read the minute combat situation more aptly and reacting on the fly.

I've bolded a section of your post that particularly resonates with me. I find it quite amusing that the more challenge epithets you cram into the title of a video the more attention you'll get, regardless of the actual quality of the content. I've seen way too many videos with a title like this "X map Y UV -fast -solo-net", where the player proceeds to cheese half of the fights and spending an hour in the process, whereas a regular UV run in 10-15 minutes would have been far more impressive to watch.

The last paragraph probably sounds like "old man yells at cloud" now that I reread it, lol.

Yeah the noxious machismo really is a big thing. You also see it with random people who insist UV is the only way to play anything in Doom even though, say, HMP is functionally the same at its core, with the differences being dictated wad to wad. I think there are just some who feel like they have to come into Doom with "something to prove", and are probably limiting their enjoyment by doing so. And hey, these are usually likely some of the first people to handwave away certain wads as "bullshit" if they prove to be too difficult for them. I don't know though, I probably just read the Youtube comments on Doom videos too much, haha.

Just now, DisgruntledPorcupine said:

Yeah the noxious machismo really is a big thing. You also see it with random people who insist UV is the only way to play anything in Doom even though, say, HMP is functionally the same at its core, with the differences being dictated wad to wad. I think there are just some who feel like they have to come into Doom with "something to prove", and are probably limiting their enjoyment by doing so. And hey, these are usually likely some of the first people to handwave away certain wads as "bullshit" if they prove to be too difficult for them. I don't know though, I probably just read the Youtube comments on Doom videos too much, haha. 

Nothing meaningful is gained by reading YouTube comments, it is true.

Not sure why people have a hard time internalizing that Doom is a video game - you play it in the way that is most rewarding for you. And that involves admitting when you need to save, or when you need to jump down in difficulty to HMP or HNTR.

Great channel. I liked the episode on Scythe very much in particular. I found his closing remarks quite interesting. He calls it the "SAT of Doom WADs" and says if you can beat it, you're in the top 1% of Doom players worldwide. What are people's thoughts on that? 

Checking that out, he says, "if you can knock every level out of the park, you're in the top 1% ... ." Knocking it out of the park seems to suggest not just getting through the final group of maps, but beating them comfortably, particularly m30 without the UV-Speed skip.

I agree with rd. Some of Scythe's final maps are extremely tough, especially MAP30. I honestly wouldn't be surprised that if you counted every Doom player ever, less than 1% could comfortably beat MAP30 on UV (that is, not save scum through a brutal slugfest of a run). I certainly haven't beaten it before.

I do quite like the SAT of Doom idea for Scythe, though, since it hits so many levels of difficulty. The point at which you think "I can't do this" is your grade, haha.

Well said, rd. Mind you, while I've personally used the term "save-scum" in a jovial manner, usually to just take the piss out of myself in my playthrough recordings, I'd never shame anyone for saving at any point. Not sure how well spread this problem really is since I've never experienced it myself or witnessed it first hand in my time with the community, I'd certainly call out anyone for pushing that kind of bullshit onto others. Perhaps I'm just naive or am simply not exploring the specific subforums where it can potentially happen, but I haven't seen even the tiniest shred of that kind of elitist nonsense on DW since I got here.

If such a thing is prevalent in the community, it's at least not around these parts as far as I can tell, which is nice. :^)

54 minutes ago, rd. said:

Knocking it out of the park seems to suggest .... beating them comfortably

15 minutes ago, Toastd said:

less than 1% could comfortably beat MAP30 on UV (that is, not save scum through a brutal slugfest of a run). 

These comments certainly provide more context to MtPain27's statement. In my case, I did manage to get through 29 maps saveless and the last stretch in particular took me countless attempts, even then I had to rely on good infighting/ monster movement (good RNG) in maps 22, 23, 24, 27, 28 and 29. A truly skilled player would be able to get the desired monster behaviour without relying on RNG. 

As for Map 30, I don't know if I'll ever be able to beat it saveless on UV