Worst official level?

Fortress of Mystery comes to my mind. Literally just three rooms, one with barons, the other full of cacodemons, and the third featuring a bizarre door opening (puzzle?) sequence where the keys are right next to the colored door that they unlock. I would say it's the laziest and worst IWAD level now that I come to think of it. Even though Warrens is mostly a copy paste of E3M1, at least there is a cool twist where you fight the cyberdemon after walking onto the gray pentagram, after which the player sees newer areas of the level that are unlocked/revealed once you start backtracking into earlier parts of the level. Fortress of Mystery reminds me of a shovelware level you would find on Maximum Doom but at least you can complete it, which is probably the best thing you can say about it.

Warrens is the best level in Doom history, but I'm mostly ok with Fortress of Mystery. it's not offensively bad, it's just a short combat level. Though i find it ironic that I've gotten there twice through E2Mwhatever, and have never taken the normal exit to that level.

On 3/20/2024 at 8:56 PM, DankMetal said:

My theory is that people love it so much because it comes after 2 levels that people find tedious, ugly and unnecessarily big (cringe opinion btw, Downtown is peak).

The inmost dens is really cool, don't get me wrong, but i think it's not that imppressive as a map.

Remember that this evaluation is done with 30 years of hindsight where we've been spoiled by excellent sets and the standards have risen significantly. Not that we should abandon this way of thinking, but in '94 'The Inmost Dens' was a genuniely good level, a proto-Plutonia slice of mapping.

Kinda trite answer (to a kinda trite topic) but Betray from the Doom Xbox port. It's a Wolf3D level where every texture is nukage. SLIGE could shit out better maps than this. Just abysmally, unsalvagably bad in every way.

well, i never liked tricks and traps on DOOM II. Hot take.

My personal least favorites from each of the IWADs:

Ultimate Doom: E2M5 (Command Center)

Doom 2: MAP09 (The Pit)

Plutonia: MAP03 (Aztec)

TNT: MAP21 (Administration Center), with MAP08 (Metal) as a close second

For me it definitely is the entirety of Ultimate Doom Episode 3. Combat is exhausting, mapping is complicated in a way that you constantly get lost and don't know where to go. Hellish esthetique looks dumb, as it was simply done for grotesque, without any actual artistic thought behind it

Let be play a bit of devil's advocate here... I think Factory and Downtown suffer from bland architecturing and texturing (maybe more of a technical limitation of its time, like, compare them to the Honte Remastered versions (https://www.moddb.com/mods/honte-remastered) they are pretty cool) but otherwise are not thaaaat bad. They manage to feel different to the levels that come previously. Like, you arrive at The Factory and immediately feel you're in a different place, like "ok this is not regular Doom anymore", idk.

On the other hand let me join the hate for E3M2.. it really is annoying. And from first episode E1M6 feels like it drags on... not by any means the worst in the game but I feel it's at least the worst in E1.

On 3/22/2024 at 1:13 AM, Amaruψ said:

The first episode that they developed after Tom Hall's departure, and his lack of creative input shows through the amateurish nature of this episode. 

You seem to have forgotten that they developed the entirety of Doom II in-between Tom’s departure and the creation of Thy Flesh Consumed. It’s fine you don’t like the levels, but it’s not because they were amateurs at this point.

On 4/7/2024 at 3:57 PM, Napeyear said:

Fortress of Mystery comes to my mind. Literally just three rooms, one with barons, the other full of cacodemons, and the third featuring a bizarre door opening (puzzle?) sequence where the keys are right next to the colored door that they unlock.

I always thought this was to stop or slow down players who were trying to peace out of the level without taking on all the monsters - like, if they were gonna be chickens and leave, they'd have to still be dodging fireballs while they mess around with all the key doors.  

And yeah, this level sucks, the worst in Doom 1. 

Baron's Den, tho

Deimos Lab or E2M4.
I always forget you have to jump in the damaging floor to press the skull switch and it’s easy to get lost. 

On 4/14/2024 at 6:05 PM, Maximum Matt said:

And yeah, this level sucks, the worst in Doom 1. 

Nah I'm pretending that i don't like this level, let's talk about the actual worst level, which I have finally came to after a lot of thinking.

Fortress of Mystery may have been lazy, but E3M7 is dissapointing and unfun. Such a bad switch puzzle, so little enemies for the penultimate stage, and it's so ugly.

The entirety of Inferno. Just all of it.

might be unpopular opinion, but E1M4 (Command Control)

19 hours ago, entropy122 said:

might be unpopular opinion, but E1M4 (Command Control)

Yeah I always hated that level

Different people have different tastes. One man's trash is another man's treasure.

When I was very little I played with God Mode on and being telefragged on Map30 gave me the biggest jumpscare I had in my life. So Map30 brings me good memories in regards to horror maps. I still get jumpscared if I get telefragged without knowing it. The same applied to the sector in E1M8, albeit to a lesser degree.

My opinion may change but now I find E3M8 very underwhelming. Even without a BFG.

On 4/17/2024 at 6:14 AM, entropy122 said:

might be unpopular opinion, but E1M4 (Command Control)

Personally I like that one; tech with a bit of industrial, monsters not too hard or easy, a cool trick or two.

We all have our likes and dislikes, no harm, no foul; but I am curious: what are your reasons for disliking it?

18 hours ago, Martin Howe said:

Personally I like that one; tech with a bit of industrial, monsters not too hard or easy, a cool trick or two.

 

We all have our likes and dislikes, no harm, no foul; but I am curious: what are your reasons for disliking it?

my incompetence makes me get lost a lot.

21 hours ago, entropy122 said:

my incompetence makes me get lost a lot.

Bro, you would HATE TNT Evilution

On 4/17/2024 at 6:59 PM, Pure Hellspawn said:

My opinion may change but now I find E3M8 very underwhelming. Even without a BFG. 

Nothing is more underwhelming than E4M8... I can pistol start it on UV with fast monsters, but I can't even do E4M1 on HMP. (Yes, I'm not very good at DOOM, but it just puts into perspective how weak the bossfight is)

I remember playing episode 4 when I was a kid, I worked my ass off just to see that the bossfight was just the Spider Mastermind. I was so crushed lol

19 minutes ago, Baron T. Mueriach said:

Nothing is more underwhelming than E4M8... I can pistol start it on UV with fast monsters, but I can't even do E4M1 on HMP. (Yes, I'm not very good at DOOM, but it just puts into perspective how weak the bossfight is)

 

I remember playing episode 4 when I was a kid, I worked my ass off just to see that the bossfight was just the Spider Mastermind. I was so crushed lol

When you say you cant do E4M1 on HMP do you mean max or just a run? Maxing is hard because of the secret barons.

58 minutes ago, Pure Hellspawn said:

When you say you cant do E4M1 on HMP do you mean max or just a run? Maxing is hard because of the secret barons.

Max specifically. Normal runs on that level are fine if you don't spend too much time in one place.

Icon of Sin. Just a massive empty area that you can't even UV Max properly

1 hour ago, WhateverComic07 said:

Icon of Sin. Just a massive empty area that you can't even UV Max properly

You can, you probably just play ZDoom or a port like that.

On 3/19/2024 at 9:21 PM, Enzo Carozza said:

Ultimate Doom - E3M8: Dis
Underwhelming bossfight; trivial on continuous runs, tedious on pistol starts.

Coincidentally, not ten minutes ago I finished a casual UV run of the game. I rushed the Spider and dumped two or three BFG shots at him and finished the fight in about five seconds. 

14 hours ago, DecoyZulu said:

Coincidentally, not ten minutes ago I finished a casual UV run of the game. I rushed the Spider and dumped two or three BFG shots at him and finished the fight in about five seconds. 

On 3/19/2024 at 8:21 PM, Enzo Carozza said:

Ultimate Doom - E3M8: Dis
Underwhelming bossfight; trivial on continuous runs, tedious on pistol starts.

And this is the best summary of Dis.

If you play this fight in a single segment, you will be dissapointed by it's short length and ease.

If you play this fight from a pistol start, you will be dissapointed by it's tedious peek-a-boo fighting style and required monster infighting (That might not be true, but it makes the fight a whole lot easier.)

There is literally nothing good about Dis, it is worthless, the sorriest excuse for a final level. Let's all be honest annd say the truth: The Tower of Babel could've been a better final level than this piece of garbage.

48 minutes ago, ᒐack102 said:

There is literally nothing good about Dis, it is worthless, the sorriest excuse for a final level. Let's all be honest annd say the truth: The Tower of Babel could've been a better final level than this piece of garbage.

The funny thing is I haven't played the first game in a few years and I was positive going through again that Tower of Babel was the final level.

The Dis fight could be acceptable if it had occurred at the end of a full, proper level and you threw some more monsters and items into the room.

12 minutes ago, DecoyZulu said:

The Dis fight could be acceptable if it had occurred at the end of a full, proper level and you threw some more monsters and items into the room.

They finally got that right in E4M8; for my money, E4M8 is what E3M8 should have been.

3 minutes ago, Martin Howe said:

They finally got that right in E4M8; for my money, E4M8 is what E3M8 should have been.

Still need to beat that level, I'm trying to be episode on UV, but I might switch to HMP to get there quicker.

In Playstation Doom, Tower of Babel WAS the final map of the Inferno segment, and it felt better that way. I remember being surprised by it coming after Spawning Vats when I finally got my hands on PC Doom 1